Hemp protein powder for Gouty Vegan

[Rebecca Nahid]

Wanting to buy a hemp protein powder flavoured with chocolate. Because it would be really handy for me on days when I’m on the go and just want to incorporate some different sources of protein in my diet.

Can anyone see the problem this could cause in bringing on a gout attack?

I’ve researched hemp and from what I can see it’s low in purine so shouldn’t be a problem. But I just wondered about having it as a protein shake. The one that I have seen just contains pure hemp powder and cocoa powder.

Thanks in advance

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Chocolate flavor Vegan Protein for Gout

[nobody]

I suspect the problem here is not so much the product as such but how you’re going to use it.
So far as I know, people generally use protein powders to live on bad diets. Protein powders also make it easy to consume too much protein which can indirectly make gout worse (but at that point you’d have bigger problems than gout). Normal foods are generally safer.

Another problem is that you’re vegan which means you can easily end up with a protein deficiency by diversifying carelessly. So far as I know, hemp proteins are kind of like the proteins in most nuts: a poor choice for vegans, except in small amounts.
Vegans should get much of their protein from stuff like soy, cauliflower, beans, spinach or lentils.

[d q]

Rebecca, I would have to agree with nobody on this. Try and get your protein from natural sources such as lentils and beans.

Would it not be possible to make yourself a protein rich smoothie for when you are on the go? I’m not much of a fan myself of smoothies and some say they are good and some say their bad but I would assume if you need an occasional mobile protein boost maybe that might be an option for you rather then powders.

[Rebecca Nahid]

I get what you’re saying but the sources of protein that you’ve mentioned which I do really enjoy unfortunately seem to keep coming up and rearing the ugly head on the purine scale! I keep reading that soybeans cauliflower etc should be avoided and it’s just getting so ridiculous that my head is all over the place with my past eating disorder I find I’m even avoiding vegetable sources of protein because it’s becoming an obsession. I’m just sick to death of the information out there there’s always seems so negative you can’t even have a high purine plant Diet. What the hell should you eat! sorry for the Rant but you can see how much it’s getting to me currently fighting off another Flare up and all I can think of is I had some bloody peanut butter on toast lol

[nobody]

The purine problem is solved by allopurinol. Maybe a small dose increase could reassure you but based on your latest test result, it’s not strictly necessary.
Protein deficency on the other hand… that’s not going to be solved by any drug. And vegans are at risk of protein deficiency (especially lysine). The solution isn’t eating more protein but more plants containing a better protein mix.
So it seems to me your priority should be clear: you should eat soy, beans and so forth. Peanuts and wheat do not contain as much lysine.

About “high purine plant Diet”, we can go over the numbers together if you want but the bottom line is that there seem to be very few plants which have a very high amount of purines. So one plant-based diet can certainly have more purines than another plant-based diet but it’s nothing like the amount of purines you could be getting from animal flesh (or yeast). What matters is the numbers and not relative judgements like “high” or “low”.
Yes, dairy has less purines and a better protein mix than (most) plants but if you pick the right plants, the difference isn’t such a big deal.

We can also go over the protein numbers together if you want but I think you’ll get basically the same information from pretty much any mainstream dietary advice for vegans.

[d q]

Rebecca, another thing you should take into careful consideration is in fact stress levels. Although it may not directly effect your gout (some may differ) it will however disturb the way you live your life which can and will result in a life led by gout and not general wellbeing. Gout is a chronic condition however life isn’t, it’s temporary. You’ll never outrun gout but gout can outrun you.

Let me know if you ever wish to talk more about the psychological effects.

Get yourself to Turkey and have the best time you can 🙂

[Rebecca Nahid]

Thank you for your kind comments that’s really nice of you I suppose I have replaced the obsession over calories that I used to have with Foods and what I can and can’t eat and any kind of restriction to someone that’s had an eating disorder is not good at all and leads to very negative thought processes.

It just seems odd to me that the last two gout flare-ups I had looking at my food diary one time I had quite a large portion of hummus and another time was quite a large portion of peanut butter buy large I don’t mean bucket loads though and as you pointed out still not comparable to animal proteins so it just doesn’t make sense for me and I definitely don’t think I need a dose increase not with my uric acid is so low so really cannot find them why I had the flare ups or maybe they are just pure coincidence

I’m careful about sore though and definitely would not be back to drinking dairy not just for the fact that I’m vegan but also I did previously had breast cancer 5 years ago which was oestrogen positive although plant estrogens seem to fall in the same category as plant purines not seen as Potent as those from animal sources I suppose all of that just has a knock on effect in the everything I eat I have to constantly worry over which I know is ridiculous

[Rebecca Nahid]

Sorry meant to say soya not sore

[nobody]

A vegan trying to avoid phytoestrogens sounds like a recipe for protein deficiency. There are alternatives to soy of course but they’ve supposedly got a fair amount of phytoestrogens too.
I guess you could in principle eat loads and loads of cauliflower and rapini but realistically…
Are you taking a supplement? If not, have you been checked for lysine deficiency lately?

About hummus and peanuts, I wouldn’t be surprised if they were trigger foods for you. Fats and salt can be an issue. But possibly it’s something else entierly that gets your immune system worked up.
If you’re talking about industrially-processed foods, there could be a common ingredient. Otherwise, one attack per food doesn’t even qualify as a coincidence yet.

[Rebecca Nahid]

So do you think I should continue to consume peanut butter and hummus as I agree with you I think one attack isn’t enough. I should have mentioned that they were not shop bought, they were both home made so would have no other chemicals or preservatives, probably why I consumed a larger portion as were so tasty!

I take multi-vitamins, don’t want to be drawn into any discussions re the controversy over them, with my past problems with food they are also a good way to get B12 which even non-vegans can be deficient in due to modern day farming practise. Would lysine deficiency show up on a blood test? As have mentioned before I have a full blood count every six months and nothing has even shown up as deficient, doctors have always gone over results with me and been very happy.

With the soya issue there is still very much undecided I would say within the medical community over whether it protects against breast cancer or could be harmful. I think the problem was the studies into Asian populations that seemed to show a protective effect -the people there consumed moderate amounts, plus live a much healthier lifestyle overall. Thus lots of people in western worlds went mad for soya buying soya milk, burgers, cheese and even supplements etc…I lived on soya products when I first went vegan, I have no idea if that contributed to my breast cancer, I was told tumours can take time to form, and prior to being vegan I was extremely overweight and a heavy drinker, I try not to over analyse that as I did in the past, so I think this is why I am struggling so much at the moment with the food issues I long for a day I can eat without guilt whether over cancer, gout or weight!

[nobody]

Sure, keep eating hummus and peanut butter for the time being. You’re avoiding enough foods already!

I don’t know what the controversy about multi-vitamins is about but lysine ain’t a vitamin and the most multi-vitamin pills wouldn’t have it. For one thing, you need a much larger volume of lysine than all vitamins combined.
There are blood tests for lysine. Sometimes it’s tested as part of a full amino acids test. But such tests aren’t routinely done here, except perhaps of infants.
I don’t know what your diet is like so I have no idea how likely you are to have serious deficiencies but the way you talk about purines and phytoestrogens is worrying.
If it’s only soy you avoid, fine. You could even avoid all beans as well as green peas if you ate enough lentils and chickpeas. I don’t know how much muscle there’s on you and so forth so I don’t know your requirements but my guess is that about 80g lentils (uncooked and unsoaked) plus 80g chickpeas (uncooked and unsoaked) per day would cover your requirements. If you’re eating loads of cauliflower, rapini, turnip greens, spinach and such, that could cover part of your requirements and lessen your need for legumes. Quinoa and potatoes would also lessen your need for legumes but not by all that much.

[Rebecca Nahid]

Thanks for your replies, out of interest what is “Rapini?” If I am honest with you and myself my diet isn’t that great, I don’t eat lots of saturated fat or junk food and my cholesterol, blood pressure etc..is fine plus the blood tests come back showing no deficiencies in major things like iron, protein, B12, calcium etc…so on paper I look fine. I am a bit overweight as do have a fondness for things like nuts, olives, olive oil and avocado which hopefully are all a good part of keeping a gout free diet. I don’t get enough protein I know that, and this whole current purine/calorie/phytoestrogen obsession doesn’t help! I hope I haven’t painted an overall picture of vegan diets being unhealthy because I have so many vegan friends who put me to shame who eat hearty and balanced diets without needing to supplement and are well into old age. What I will say is this, ignore whether I am vegan or not I have had a long standing eating disorder and that unfortunately comes and goes. I am no longer bulimic but the issues over food and my weight will probably never go away although I hope they do!

[nobody]

Rapini is a green cruciferous vegetable. You might call it something else. Supposedly that type of vegetable is helpful for people who want to suppress estrogens. That type of vegetable also tends to have lots of lysine (relative to other vegetables or to the calories they contain).

I’d be surprised if you didn’t eat enough protein. More likely, you’re not eating the right proteins.
I realize it’s not that hard for adults to eat a healthy vegan diet but it’s harder than for non-vegans. And it seems quite common for vegans to have deficiencies in practice.
What test was used to establish that you used not to have a protein deficiency? It might not be specific enough. Such tests aren’t routinely done here so I can’t possibly guess what was tested in your case.

[Rebecca Nahid]

I don’t know about specific tests I just know that everything came back normal and my doctor said everything was fine. Most vegans I know get all their proteins from soya, beans, vegetables and also through combining foods. I am not a good example of a vegan as I have had an eating disorder. I also know many non vegans who eat a very bad diet, and while many concentrate on protein, a lot neglect fibre for example. I am weary of eating too much protein I just try to stick to the recommeneded daily amount as too much makes it harder to excrete.

[Toni Lee]

This is not a food but try rubbing CBD oil on the area. Takes away pain swelling and redness. Also, take orally this is known to help gout! I swear by this it works wonders!

Have you tried CBD Oil for your Gout?

CBD for gout is a miracle. Rub oil on feet swelling redness pain gone!

[Keith Taylor]

I’m not sure if this post is the prompt. But people have been asking me help desk questions like “is CBD oil good for gout”.

There’s not much point asking me because I have no knowledge of, or interest in, CBD oil and related products. But I found a couple of studies that might be useful:
Devinsky, Orrin, Maria Roberta Cilio, Helen Cross, Javier Fernandez‐Ruiz, Jacqueline French, Charlotte Hill, Russell Katz et al. “Cannabidiol: pharmacology and potential therapeutic role in epilepsy and other neuropsychiatric disorders.” Epilepsia 55, no. 6 (2014): 791-802.

Medicinal preparations from the flowers and resin of Cannabis sativa have been used in China since ~2700 BCE to treat menstrual disorders, gout, rheumatism, malaria, constipation, and absent-mindedness.

Ryz, Natasha R., David J. Remillard, and Ethan B. Russo. “Cannabis roots: a traditional therapy with future potential for treating inflammation and pain.” Cannabis and cannabinoid research 2, no. 1 (2017): 210-216.
This review cites 8 previous studies claiming benefits of cannabis for gout. Not specifically CBD oil:

In general, the historical records indicate that cannabis root is most often extracted with boiling water and applied topically to treat gout

But all the gout references are hundreds of years old. However, if there are modern applications the authors note:

It is clear there are many different chemotypes of cannabis, including THC predominant, CBD predominant, and mixed types.60 Future research should compare the phytochemistry of hemp roots with those from various drug chemovars to determine if there are differences in active compounds.

As I said, I can’t be much help on this topic. But I’m happy to keep checking for relevant studies as long as the interest continues.

[Kymberly Ponegalek]

Does CBD oil help gout?

Hi again,
I am trying to read through the old posts. They have been so informative and such a help emotionally. I want to have a plan in place if it turns out that I have gout and have another attack.

So far I am hearing that taking colchicine (while keeping the joint mobile) will shorten the duration of the pain/attack by reducing inflammation, and that ibuprofen (or something similar) will reduce pain. Is that correct?

I am unclear about whether opting NOT to use colchicine is harmful. Is it bad to let the inflammation run its course rather than take the drug? Does the inflammation itself cause damage? Does the colchicine prevent damage? Does it have other benefits besides shortening the duration of the attack?

I am also hearing that if I have gout and my uric acid is higher than 6.0, I should use allopurinol to lower it to 5.0 or less. Keeping it low for life is key is what I’m hearing. What I’m not sure of: Does a person stay on allopurinol for life, without interruption, or do they cycle on and off of it as needed?

I haven’t come across anything (yet) in the posts about cbd oil for a gout attack. Has anyone ever tried it? Is it legal where you are? Is it strong enough? It is supposed to help with both inflammation and pain.

I appreciate your patience with my very beginner questions.

Thanks so much,
Kymberly

[nobody]

Wait until you have ascertained how much uric acid there is in your blood to worry about allopurinol.

Ibuprofen and similar drugs reduce inflammation and therefore pain. They are the most straightforward way to quickly stop a gout flare, provided you can tolerate this class of drug.
Colchicine is more complicated to use. It does not provide quick relief but basically makes gouty episodes weaker and shorter. It could also prevent the formation of uric acid crystals but allopurinol is much more effective in that respect anyway. You don’t have to use colchicine but it could allow you to reduce your intake of ibuprofen-type drugs. If a reasonable amount of ibuprofen is enough to make your flares go away, there’s little point in taking colchicine at the same time but you could still take a small amount every day for a few weeks to reduce the likelihood of a serious gout attacks.
So far as I can tell, colchicine is pretty safe as long as you only take small amounts for a limited amount of time. It has obvious side effects which typically prevent people from abusing it. Ibuprofen-type drugs may seem harmless in contrast but it has side effects which often remain unnoticed and prolonged use can potentially be deadly even if you do not exceed the recommended dose.
The matter of keeping the joint mobile is also complicated. But hopefully your gout isn’t bad enough that you have to worry about this.
Finally, inflammation can cause damage but doesn’t do so in most cases (or at least the damage is hardly noticeable). Gout can cause lasting damage separately from inflammation anyway so you should not delay managing the amount of uric acid in your system if you have gout even if you can suppress symptoms with anti-inflammatories.

I doubt CBD oil would be competitive with proper anti-inflammatory drugs. Considering how bad gout can get if you allow it to develop, giving such remedies a try may not be as harmless as it seems. But really, I have no idea how effective it is. More importantly, I don’t know what the side-effects might be.
I should also warn you against painkillers more generally and acetaminphen/paracetamol in particular. You can of course take painkillers but you should not use them instead of proper anti-inflammatories or to delay proper treatment.

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