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Having recently discovered this site and this forum, I’d like to add my own experiences to the discussions.
A bit of background. I have suffered from gout for more than 15 years. And only true gout sufferers know the meaning of ‘suffer’ when it comes to gout. I’ve had gout in my ankle, my toes and even my wrists. I don’t have to tell you the pain I have had, the days off from work or the looks from people when you say you have gout. My doctor ran the tests and wanted to put me on medications but a friend at work who also had gout told me that many times the medicines were as bad as the Gout.
I was in my early 40s. At the time I was married to a woman heavy into natural foods and vitamin supplements. Along with a change in my diet (low sugar, low protein, no shellfish, no red meat etc) we searched for a more natural way of handling the Gout. It was a long search. In the meantime, we discovered Cherry Juice for the treatment of flare-ups. I kept the cherry juice (unsweetened black cherry juice concentrate) handy and continued to look for a natural alternative to the medicines.
One day, my wife discovered an article in one of her many health magazines written by a nutritionist concerning his own experiences with gout and how his friends chided him for being such an adamant naturalist and yet having to take medications for gout. It was this article chronicling his discovery which introduced me to Ground Celery Seed. Celery Seed helps make the body’s system more ‘basic.’ (As we remember from Junior High School Science, ‘basic’ is the opposite of ‘acidic.’)
This nutritionist (the article has been lost, but someday I hope to find it again and give credit to the man) explained his own medicinal levels and how, after his research turned up Ground Celery Seed as a possible alternative, he literally went “cold turkey” and began working with GCC, documenting his experiences. He never went back to the Medicines. He converted totally to GCC. To make a long story short, I had to try it.
I began taking two standardized capsules (the nutritionist in the article started at the same level) of Ground Celery Seed at night before bed. I purchased the brand ‘Solaray’ at a local health food store. There are no side effects to speak of (other than occasional burps which taste like alphalpha) and I found that with a good Gout diet I had literally no flareups for the better part of a year. My only problems (flareups) came when I indulged in too much sugar, wine, or maybe a good burger (I was and shall always be a sucker for a good BK Whopper!); in other words, when I went too far off the Gout Diet. At these times I now know I can take an extra dose (a total of 4 capsules) at night to help combat the overindulgence.
Make no mistake, I am still on the Gout Diet, yet now and then I feel I can indulge (albeit in small amounts) without waking up with a foot so swollen I can’t even THINK of putting a shoe on it. I also keep Cherry Juice in the house for any flare-ups. One 16 ounce bottle of concentrate (unsweetened) becomes nearly a gallon of cherry juice. I drink most of this in a 24-36 hour period and gout flareups are taken care of quickly.
Recently I have switched to using Ground Celery Seed Tablets from Puritans Pride. The cost is negligible when I purchase them on sale and even with an indulgence now and then, I’ve not had any flareups for more than 2 years.
I share this hoping to help more like myself.
Read more about Celery Seeds and Gout. Nothing like experience- keep us posted!
I don't mind trying meds, but as you say, they can be hard going.
I've never tried celery seeds, but if they are that good- maybe, with low dose UL meds, they could be a plus?
Effectively controlling symptoms is all well and good, as I discovered is possible with Chinese herbs, but without knowing SUA levels this will simply be slowing down or masking the steady build up of urate and other long term implications of high uric acid. I think once the science and progression of the disease is understood it is not easy to ignore this fact and convince oneself the situation is under control.
The good news is that if one is prepared to continue with a healthy gout diet (plus whatever supplements) when starting Allopurinol, it should be possible to reduce SUA to safe levels on a low dose.
odo said:
Effectively controlling symptoms is all well and good, as I discovered is possible with Chinese herbs, but without knowing SUA levels this will simply be slowing down or masking the steady build up of urate and other long term implications of high uric acid. I think once the science and progression of the disease is understood it is not easy to ignore this fact and convince oneself the situation is under control.
The good news is that if one is prepared to continue with a healthy gout diet (plus whatever supplements) when starting Allopurinol, it should be possible to reduce SUA to safe levels on a low dose.
Wise words indeed, odo
Uric acid crystals tend to grow very slowly, and often go unnoticed. Unfortunately, without uric acid control, they will reach a level where:
- Acute gout flares become more frequent and more intense.
- Permanent damage to bones, ligaments & tendons from the corrosive effects of gouty tophi.
And this happens later in life when one is less able to cope.
Any form of gout treatment, whether medical, herbal, or dietary, MUST be accompanied by uric acid testing at least twice a year. Monthly is better.
GoutPal said:
Wise words indeed, odo
Uric acid crystals tend to grow very slowly, and often go unnoticed. Unfortunately, without uric acid control, they will reach a level where:
- Acute gout flares become more frequent and more intense.
- Permanent damage to bones, ligaments & tendons from the corrosive effects of gouty tophi.
And this happens later in life when one is less able to cope.
Any form of gout treatment, whether medical, herbal, or dietary, MUST be accompanied by uric acid testing at least twice a year. Monthly is better.
Let me add my two cents or a nickel's worth:
I have been taking daily my 1 oz conc. black cherry juice for more than 5 years.
I buy ground celery seeds in 5# lots and add it to my salads, home-baked breads, and wherever appropriate. (2 cents worth)
I happen to be later in life (approaching 80).
I, also, happen to have had gout for more than 26 years.
I have gouty tophi on fingers and both feet (toes). (A nickle's worth)
I can confirm GP's comment: Uric acid crystals tend to grow very slowly.
I can further confirm: They often go unnoticed, especially by me and my DOCTORS.
I must admit, unfortunately, without uric acid control, they will reach a level where:
I had acute gout flares which became more frequent and more intense. And
I know that I have permanent damage to bones, ligaments & tendons from the corrosive effects of gouty tophi. (A dime's worth)
After all that I, I, I business, let me assure everybody that GoutPal's repeated statement should be written in stone: You must control (manage) your gout! And the only way you know that you are doing it and succeeding, is by KNOWING your SUA (Serum Uric Acid) level, and it better be below 6.8 mg/dl, preferably below 4-5 mg/dl.
Celery:
Anecdotally celery was used to treat any disease resulting in swelliing, thus osteoarthritis, rheumatoid arthritis, and gout. The swelling is reduced becasue celery is a light diuretic. Yes, swelling decreases when water and salt are dumped by the kidneys.
But it is pretty well documented that ANY diuretic has a ugly side effect: it retains uric acid by the kidneys. So, given that a decrease in swelling is NOT proper treatment of gout, one should rethink celery as a gout tonic. Decreasing swelling while increasing uric acid might be a quicker qway to get GP informative tombsone all for one's own use.
So many of these old saws come from the days of the charlatans selling their nostrums from buckboards topeople with aching backs…lumbago. Celery is no exception:
In the early days of soda pops, celery seed was a widely used ingredient in refreshing drinks. Since ancient times, celery has been used as a medicinal herb, with properties as a relaxant.
Dr. Brown's Celery Tonic was first served in 1869 and has been bottled and sold since at least 1886. Legend has it that Dr. Brown first created his celery tonic for immigrant children on the Lower East Side of Manhattan, but there is little information about whether he even existed.
I believe it was called Cel-Ray. Bad information is hard to lose, like a bad penny and generations keep repeating the same nonsense.
Celery is good in stews…and sticking out of a spicy Bloody Mary.
The “problem” I have with “natural” or “homeopathic” medications is that they aren't lab tested (or at least that I know of) and I don't know how we can know that we're getting the “right” amount in the “right” concentration. My liver specialist specifically warned me about taking any homeopathic meds without checking with him first. Seems that many of them can have a harmful effect on the liver. He isn't “anti-homeopathic”, he's just being cautious. Commercially available meds have their well-documented issues and certainly aren't perfect, but they are lab tested and the strength/dosage is standardized…just my humble opinion, I could be wrong!
Does anyone else have good results from celery seed (or cherry juice, for that matter?) Among those for whom these are effective, are they preventions or cures? Still trying to get my head around that.
Thanks!
I don't know for sure yet. ?I need relief!! ?I'm on day 1 of medrol dosepak. ?My ankle is killing me.
Well now, here are some things I know about: celery, black cherries, and gout.
First of all: about black cherries, and black cherry juice, here is a stern word of warning to the wise: cherries, and cherry juice, are LOADED with sugar. If you are diabetic (or pre-diabetic, or have insulin resistance) you cannot and must not eat large quantities of cherries, or drink lots of cherry juice, with abandon! This is not even a debatable point, one cannot intake large amounts of sugar if they have diabetes, or if they are headed in the direction of diabetes. Don't screw around with this!
There is one way I know of to gain the benefits of black cherries without excessive sugar intake, and that is black cherry extract.
I have found this formulation to be somewhat helpful, but it is by no means a panacea.
Now on to celery.
When I had my first acute gout attack in 2006, my naturopathic doctor coached me about good gout diet, and he gave me the following prescription: eat 3 stalks of organic celery a day. Regular celery is not good, it has lots of pesticides and lacks the “vitality” of organic celery. (Hey, that's what my doctor said).
I followed that regimen for about 4 years, and I had an acute gout attack about once a year.
Then a funny thing happened: one day I absolutely, positively could not stomach the thought of even another bite of celery! I'm not kidding, to this very day the sight of celery makes me want to gag. Understatement!
So I started taking a standardized celery seed extract by Natural Factors:
http://www.allstarhealth.com/f/natural_factors-celery_seed_extract.htm
This stuff is recommended by a well-known naturopathic doctor (he graduated from a local naturopathic school with an excellent reputation, so I think he has good credibility). Celery seed extract is also good for cardiovascular health. You can download a PDF of his article about this stuff here:
http://www.lifestylevitaminsupplements.com/images/Dr-Murray-Celery-Seed-Extract.pdf
Well, as far as gout goes, this celery seed extract did not work as well as eating celery, though it was helpful in conjunction with a good gout diet. I started having acute attacks about every 6 months.
Then about a year ago I stumbled and fell while hiking and badly jammed my “big gout toe”. This provoked the mother of all gout attacks in that toe! When I recovered from this attack I could clearly see (visually) that I had finally developed a tophi on my big toe joint. And the attacks kept coming. I increased my celery seed intake and went on a full vegetarian diet, but by the start of 2011 I cried “uncle”. I was in too much pain too often and I practially begged my MD to prescribe Allopurinal. I have posted about that in these forums previously, and should probably update that post because I have learned my gout is MUCH worse than anyone ever suspected. I have been paying dearly for this as the Allopurinol allows the gout deposits in my feet and ankles dissolve. Almost constant gout pain in one joint or another for the past four months!
My bottom line is: I wish I had not been so phobic about taking a prespecription medicine for my gout! Things would have been much easier overall (there would have been much less pain and agony) if I'd started taking Allopurinol when my MD first suggested it.
I strongly urge anyone that is experiementing with natural remedies and diet to keep in mind you are experimenting on yourself, and if things do not work out, you will pay the consequences. If celery seed and black cherries cause a total remission of gout attacks I would say, “carry on”, but if you continue with sporadic attacks, please take my case into consideration and get on the Allopurinal! Because it is only a matter of time before you do, and the longer you wait the more you will pay.
Well that's my story and hard-won advice.
Andrew said:
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I strongly urge anyone that is experiementing with natural remedies and diet to keep in mind you are experimenting on yourself, and if things do not work out, you will pay the consequences. If celery seed and black cherries cause a total remission of gout attacks I would say, “carry on”, but if you continue with sporadic attacks, please take my case into consideration and get on the Allopurinal! (or Uloric) Because it is only a matter of time before you do, and the longer you wait the more you will pay.
Well that's my story and hard-won advice.
AMEN!
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