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External heat may make the circulation lazy!
Also, electric fields from the underblanket are not considered good for the body.
I always wake up 'toasted' even if left on the lowest, pretty minimal setting by accident.
For those with trad. podagra in the toe- this pillow/sock trick could pay!
Another aside on the circulation topic- is the cold rinse effect promoting better circulation in the extemities prior to bed.
Even during an attack,Bicarb soaks can help, hot or cold.
I hope that wasn't just cos they used a K for complete,GP! I know you're a traditionalist..
You may be right to opine on this product and remove the link- but I'm always on the lookout for alternative to meat protein [esp. Alkaline] and a word or two about your objections would be appreciated.
I'm aware of the conversion process of assimilation of food in the body producing a reversal of ph absorbed- this has always struck me as strange- but the body is a marvellous ( forget BP and Gout) and perplexing construct.
I personally would not take more than 8 x 0.5 mg tabs a day in the first days of an attack- and be wary of long term use due to effects on white blood cells and immune suppression.
The other thing to take account of is drug /drug interactions and Statins, commonly used for high chloresterol/triglicerides is one of these such, that react badly when co-administered.
I have experienced this- but not the more serious effects possible , as I ceased quickly due to gastric effects.
Side effects are neglected/understated (for obvious reasons)- often to the detriment of the unsuspecting user.
3 levels maybe?…
Severe pain, fairly early in main attack – twinges going in /out and then niggles, which just remind you how lucky you are not to be getting the other two !
Everyone is different but my experience is that 10-14 days of bad discomfort followed by the same aftermath of residual pain, but some of this is due to memories of the pain rather than actual. ie: The episode sensitizes the body rather,and there is a mental backlash to lthis.
Pain, like death is natures way of getting you to slow down- so patience is a good trait to develop…
Thus 3-4 weeks can illustrate a typical gout attack and all the dodging tactics in the world can't undo a long term build up of SUA. In time a path through the wilderness can be ascertained but not without some application and required suffering en route.
If the episodes are too painful to stand or affecting finances too badly- then drug therapy is the logical conclusion.
If you don't want to travel the meds route just yet- then thinking about your diet,rest and exercise is a must. Drugs tend to act like they are thinking for you- but of course they're not..Just ACTING for you, whilst you take a hike.
The down side of this, if you're unlucky, is that not only can you and end up with meds induced problems- but the original probllem to deal with, all over again.
Worth thinking about !
Worrying is counter-productive, though.
This doesn't quite ring the gout bell for me, VG!
With all that walking when it was worse -that would surely trigger an attack at 10+ SUA .
One thought, If it IS gout- then it may be that your immune system is not reacting as it should.
This is a part blessing- have you ever taken Immune boosting supplements like Vit C, E or Zinc?
If so, has it affected your foot pain? It does take time for the supplements to get your immune reaction levels up though and as you keep fit ,just a long shot.
Also, if your colds last a long time -or you get re-current infections?
Lets be honest- Gout is bloody Painful.
I have heard it said that it's a bad as a heart attack – and that either kills you -or gets treated with respect.
Thinking about pain like this is perfectly acceptable- and, given the low profile of gout affliction,bound to happen. It's a bugger!
Doing something about it is even MORE acceptable.
Thoughts lead to actions -and actions produce results. QED.
Not ranked here -but Navy based (blush)..
Rawbones (after Sawbones)
Ropey Joints
Skipper 🙂
Caught a Crab… (oars dunked)
Lost the Plot
Shake 'n Mend ( afternoon off-after Make)
and finally..
Red Knees in the Sunset ( after Sails)
GP has already admitted to being a provoker, not a toker on the AlloP trail 🙂
However, I have a scrip filled and after the next attack will start on that track , if unable to see another way forward and having to take diuretics for best BP therapy.
I won't miss the pain of Gout , once settled on it for sure -and it's a lot easier to gauge than BP meds.
Anyone interested in good health would do well to avoid artificial sweeteners (and MSG type products, btw) completely.
Usually a burning, gnawing sensation [typically on an old site] that comes and goes randomly.Mostly presents in the evening hours.
Occasionally between attacks a very sharp shooting nerve pain in a not too well localised point-
I've never twigged what this is saying – but usually post attack after worst is over.
General pain in old joint sites if stressed too much. Does not usually start an attack.
Alcohol ,or the wrong type of food will do that very well !
I have also associated, lowish level, daily headaches for some days prior to an attack – this one took me ages to rumble.
How about Acid Leg [as opposed to Head]
Grizzly Hobbler.
Foot Swaddler.
Limpet -Mine.
Toe Torture .
-to go on the names of dubius honour.
Not wishing to play devils' advocate- but over the years I've come across stories of Distilled water drinkers and though there's nothing wrong in taking it, over a period of time minerals can be leached from the body on some reports.
If you have NO mineral deficiency related problems &/or take supplements this would probably reduce the tendency for this.
I personally wouldn't stay with distilled only, otherwise due to cost. I filter tap and use mineral water otherwise, as table top filters don't get the Fluoride out. (Nor do most other filters- only > % of Fl.).
On the acidity ? I have read that all water is acidifying in the diet, though I don't know why. and I was a bit surprised.
No reason why it shouldn't , on the other hand- if that 's how the bodies' chemistry works.
Over to you Zip !
Can't see it somehow JuNe? !
A first timer could be a professor of Gout and be ignored and a revered 'old timer' might go a bit potty [they do , you know
] and post a really dodgy bit of opinion that has no relevance in reality.Any how it makes a lot more work for our benevolent, if sometimes opinionated GP .
I reckon a new, humorous name every 100 up would keep the interest high !
I think Colchicine is a mixed blessing.
I suspect, if it hadn't already been established years ago, it wouldn't get through modern drug proving trials on safety grounds. A lot of trad. medicines are based on plant toxins like this one.
If it doesn't drive you off them totally- I read a report that as little as 7 tabs had caused a fatality- but I have still taken up to 6 as prescribed since knowing its' downside in an unlucky few.
Just don't go for the quick returns with a high dosage!
People have died using asprin but it is still used/useful – but not where a body is vulnerable to side effects.
… & Yes!- Gout is a great migrator!
Once you know your particular pattern with gout, it can be managed.
With regular yearly blood checks ,at the minimum , no doubt many could manage without year on year UA lowering drugs from what's said here, but not everyone.
Hopefully more research will lead to a better understanding of this quite common ,but unduly painful illness, as well as more choice in drug therapy -as seems to be occurring slowly.
With serious outcomes for health possible- Gout definitely can't be ignored.
Everyone is different and diagnosis and drug regimes take time to get right.
I reckon this sounds very Gouty.
I've tried Strawberries and they cause me twinges if eaten daily.They may have both good and bad effects- and taking a lot ,maybe isn't helping, right now. They are on some 'bad' lists-(Oxalates?)
I had a recent attack where my last SUA was 6.5 and it went higher later.
Is the rash speckled white subcutaneous spots? This could be tophi and a good indicator of gout.
[Check in the recent Gout pics posting for comparison]
Don't forget Gout is the most painful form of arthritis and genetic. You will find it hard to deal with a frightening first attack across multi joints and it will take time to get to the bottom of it. Work stress won't help and if you don't rest you will just suffer more.
You will get a lot of help and encouragement here- so bear up -and take low level Colchicine as prescribed- it is usually kept to a low level by medics- but it will help if you have gout. Zip here loves to knock 'em back
– but mine are prescribed up to 6 a day.It's not normal for Allopurinal to be started during, or too soon, after an attack, as it can make things worse before your system can stabilise on lower SUA levels.
My experience of Cochicine is that the runs could last a couple of days.
Don't forget to replace fluid to help the gout and avoid dehydration.
It's unlikely you'll want to take more C right now, but I think 3 days delay is recommended between 'applications'. I stick to 8 tabs max, but others do more.
Quite likely, by then, esp. as your SUA is not high- you will be on the 'run down' with this attack, but that could last a week or more and you will no doubt taking good care of joints usage,
Disney or not!
I'll be happy to reach 99, or even 79 hehe- but we are the same age. BMI apart
I'm going to have to get back swimming soon- to follow your good gym example.
I understand that, during an attack 'proper', white blood cells recognise the needles as attackers and coat them- while fluid seeps into the surrounding tissues to swell and protect what is mistaken as an external injury. This does immobilse rather well , as we know.
Taking Cochicine at this point actually reduces the effectivity of the immune system going 'hell bent on a mission' and would, I suspect likely reduce the time to next attack, depending on dosage at this immediate point.
Of course, this is not a priority worry during an attack – but bears thinking about.
it's easy to see why Gout is described as a metabolic disease and equally, hard to analyse or treat between individuals responses ,as we're all different in how our bodies operate.
I notice particularly after an attack my joints and old flare sites can respond quite sensitively to food or strain factors without actually really going again for another attack. This must be the protection given by WBCs which will eventually wear off as new UA comes along in solution.
A good time to start AlloP, if you're going to, perhaps?
Hey, I'm glad my baccy 'line' didn't get an off topic note! Pleased it rang a bell !
The only, rather obvious, difference I didn't stress about the similarities was that at least food is necessary for life, even though it can be dangerous in its own subtle way. In fact ,this subtlety illustrates how hard it is to 'nail'.
I thought seeing your response that you would have no problem losing weight ,via Leptin balance, with your realistic attitude to life -and experience over smoking cessation.
I can reliably report that I can go 15 hours without hunger overnight, but resisting the toast and honey at 4am is the only minor challenge…that's when the mental training comes in and ignoring it. Decaff tea suffices.
[If still in a conventional working regime , these timings could be harder to manage.]
I do have a novel get back to sleep technique involving counting – can't remember where I learned it. [not Playboy btw 🙂 ] which helps the lying awake tendency, which food can often assuage.
Interesting what you say about the heart and lipids. The broader point is that leptin is involved in all these lower level reactions- we just don't associate them together, after all -it's a new finding.
This makes it not just novel, but extremely attractive ground for self help enquirers.
[Before Nanny State or Big Pharma get hungry for control/profit..Sorry, my rant]
All I can say, from reading the book so far, is that it's part of a wider picture that the night fast is normal, not something to be suffered.
When it runs right, I would hope it would settle down – as for me.
One concept mentioned is that 'Leptin Resistance' occurs (very like Insulin can do in Diabetes) and needs to be managed correctly.This seems to be the target function for weight loss in many cases.
On your final, you're 'dead bang on right'.
Recent reports have stressed that heavy exercise is the best and most effective cardiac improvemement and weight loss regime -and one that I don't follow [too heavily] admittedly.
I did manage 20mph on my bike yesterday , downhill -and pedalled back up mostly seated on return 🙂 and I'm older (but not heavier) than your goodself , Zip!
If you blow a few beers, that should do the trick- then you'll be sorry just like the rest of us VG!
follow with a prawn curry, of course!
-but great you got the walks exercise in successfully…
A long wait for a painful condition- any chance you can do a private Rhuematologist, as GP recommends?
In the meantime, stick to sandals with soft foamy velcro straps that can be let out a lot, with thick socks -and never mind the odd stares. [OK- if it rains you need some backup]
I go on group walks where substandard footwear is ignored totally
At least it's summer, sort of.
+Black Bean Broth !
I must stress at my quote above :
“Next day not to find a thumping heart and flushed face- but a normal BP reading” ….
that prior to this, and numerous combinations of potent lowering drugs, my BP had been nowhere near normal – ever!
I've lost over 6 months work [though needed a break, true!] through this factor.
On a more serious note- Is it possible that, assuming there's no evidence of extraction [only attraction] by the fish that they could be shifting the crystals into solution in local tissues and its then cleared by blood flow.
Maybe with some fortuitous alcohol in your system (?) the kidneys flushed it out, whilst soluble.
Sounds effective, cheap and fun- no wonder it's been banned!
I agree about the body making more of what you try to stop. I recently had 4 BP drugs stopped in one day prior to starting another whack.
I was amazed the next day not to find a thumping heart and flushed face- but a normal BP reading. The reset in this case was the wrong way (fortunately) and somehow the body adjusted rather well. At this point my faith in medicine took a knock!
Certainly it flags up the bodies tendency to 'buck the meds' and cast doubts on a chemical view of the body being as progressive as Pharma would, seems/likes to claim.
Coming off could be titrated -as for dose effecteness equally.
OK , not for everyone , but a trial would lay down some ground rules, surely?
Another lack of options on the gout trail!
Your BP is controlled, so the major non-diet factor in your case seems to be weight [and maybe the stress of a Dr Visit? 🙂 ]
I have high hopes for your reducing your AlloP dose,I 'm sure with your insight you will get some ground rules for others on the path!
Hopefully, if you look into Leptin it will spark your fertile imagination as to possibilities on the weight front too.
The best time to try this though , is not as you reduce your AlloP doseage!
But… Self testing would cover for all but the worst glitches, I would hope.
Toe sucking has always, like gout, appeared in the upper echelons of society- no wonder it's been made illegal in the US between the fish & the hoi polloi ! 😉
I've not finished the book yet and it gets quite complicated to explain the absolute details- even if I could remember them.
The first thing that comes to mind, strangely, is Smoking tobacco products.
I 've never quite bought the idea given out that it is as addictive as H ,I think it's a Habit which can be triggered by association and a myriad other connected feelings. Well, leptin seems a bit like that- a hidden top down hormone that controls everything but is hidden from out conscious control. The reason?- It's designed to keep us alive and doesn't want to be 'turned off' easily.
Ignoring false demands for food is the secret- my other posts about water might help.Thirst is mistaken for hunger as we age, starting in our early twenties,I've read.
'Turning down' even, is like stopping smoking after the next ciggy- so it's a habit that needs training [Well, you're the trainee in fact].
So we need to become our own trainer in the matter of appetite and diet patterns. it doesn't seem to matter too much what you eat so long as it's a normal balanced diet to start with- it's WHEN , not too big -and not too much carbs.
In my battle with BP [and Gout also] I realised that glycerides,UA, lbs weight etc are long term effects that build on short term triggers that seem almost harmless at the time and in controlling these as much as I could I was losing weight- so when I read this book after connecting with the concept online- I realised it was already doing the business for me without too much effort.
One of the main basics is that the body can burn fat overnight if you shut down the digestve system properly so a 12hr break is the norm between dinner/supper and breakfast.
No snacks, ever and 3 meals a day only. The routine is really simple ,but the thinking behind the approach is complex.
It's a fairly recent discovery that fat is the top hormone and it affects everything in the body ,top down essentially.
Modern life seems designed to turn off our appestats and sell us what we don't really need, only want.
In some ways, Gout seems to get the flak for this -as it illustrates an out of control status in the sufferer and maybe it serves as a hair shirt scourge the rest of society can wave at us?
[The supposedly over indulgent]
In some way, the Leptin approach appeals to me – as it is a subtle, under the counter riposte to the element of victimed hair shirt wearer not getting enough healing from society- and why I see a drug solution to it as' consumerist' in the same light.
This covers only the long term aspects of my life- there are obviously times and situations when drug interventions are really needed, in my case BP, certainly -and maybe for gout in the end.
So, it is early days,but the mental attitude we have to life and illness is fundamental as to living with it -if not always curing it!
The body will follow, hopefully.
It does seem mind over matter, at first sight, but reading the book, I think there are physiological arguments that hold the theory solid.
The main lynchpin is that we don't give our bodies time to hear the 'full' sign and get used , in a rich enough world, to taking in easy calories in excess.
One big element (no pun intended) in the gout equation is the matter of being over weight. I have been so for years and years, though I carry it well.
I have lost a stone since I was weighed in the heart clinic 3 months ago [100Kg] without diet,as such.
I simply stopped frying except rarely,very little salt( thus stopping excess fluid retention) & carbohydrates -and then paced meals according to the Leptin Diet, which is not a diet as such but means moderate self disciplne in meal types and timings. No food is banned!
[To precis: 3 main, moderate size !! meals. Reduce carbs
11+ hours overnight break (no snacks ever) with a high protein breakfast].
Mmmmm…but smallish !!
This protocol relies on the fact that fat is a master hormone controller and this loop needs to be reset over time.
This 'diet' is free- and will work unless you have other underlying problems.
It can't do harm like modern diets can ,anyway.
This is just one piece in the jigsaw, but a vital one in the fight against Big G !
I'm sorry to say ,as a beer lover myself, that not only is alcohol bad for gout it also puts weight on brilliantly- so this is excluded -as it is not a 'food' anyway but a Gov't licenced drug.[Be honest !]
If you are serious about good health in general then you will need to watch your vitamin and mineral balance whilst consuming large amounts of fluid, as you stated.
This is not a medical site, as stated many times elsewhere – but self help is top of any good life management list and GoutPal is full of tips for just this very thing!
I intend to expand a bit on this 'Leptin thing' in its'own thread
– I think it has mileage for gout repair- but was prompted by your exposition on weight factor in this thread.This is the easiest protocol ever- sio give it a serious try.
Sounds a nice recipe. I will try it.
I'm getting BB today, either sort, but due to not have any current UA reducing drugs i will strain out the the bean pulp to make sure- no mistakes.
At the moment , my last attck is very quiescent and just tweaking at night.
I have got high hopes that this will be effective- from the glowing reports here and will test in out in anger, as and when I need , freezing the broth after trying it out.
I never did like Blueberries, anyway! [Full of Anthicyamins, if I recall right]
Any reports back from earlier trials as mentioned previously?
